Replacing the traveler

[Chris Campbell]

Hi gang,

I'm replacing the traveler on Luna as part of my restoration - the old one wasn't working very well and I had to remove the 'glassed-in towers as part of my deck recore anyway - so I've got a blank slate to start with.

Background: the stock traveler on the Yankee 30 is on the cabin top, it runs across the aft end of the sea hood, and is a straight piece of track.

For replacement, I see two options:
1. Get a straight track traveler from Garhauer (could be elsewhere, but I like their stuff and their prices) with a pair of risers to lift it above the companionway (1 pair UR-1, 1 MT-UB1). This would be essentially the same thing that I removed, although the risers would be metal instead of 'glassed-in blocks of wood, so they'd be less visually obstructive.
2. Get a piece of aluminum bent to match the curve of the cabin top and have a piece of track bent to the same shape to bolt to it - thus giving me a curved traveler which wouldn't stand so high off the deck at the ends. This would be more of a custom solution, but might look better - and probably would cost about the same since the track wouldn't need to be as strong, since it would be supported all the way along.

The advantage to #1 is that it's an off-the-shelf solution, I just bolt it in place and go. The advantage to #2 is that it might look a little better, and be easier to see over when seated on the cockpit seats (which is where I'll be, with tiller steering). I have seen boats equipped both ways, and can't think of any functional reason to prefer one over the other - so it's really just aesthetics.

Here's a picture of another boat with method #1 in place:

And another with #2:


Any thoughts?

Thanks,

Chris

[Hirilondë]

For the most part I am a fan of curves, especially those that follow the camber of the deck or cabin top that the item in question is on/over. If a traveler can follow the curve of you cabin top, minimize obstructing your view, still meet all of its function and be strong enough (the loads on mid boom sheets are double that of end boom) then I think you are on the right track (pun intended).

By the way, your second photo should be posted in the bad boat names thread as well (zoom in on the transom over the dodger).

[Chris Campbell]

Good point about the boat name thread!

I've been pondering this and discussing with others and it turns out there is a functional reason to stick with flat - or even a reverse curve. Trouble is that as the traveler is moved off-centre, it will tighten the mainsheet, since the car will move further from the boom. So if you're already snug for going upwind and decide to bring the car to windward to point even higher, you'll need to slack it. Or if you want to dump the traveler in a puff, it'll probably not even be able to go down!

So I think I'm best off with the flat traveler, and I'll live with the aesthetic. Once I get a dodger in place I shouldn't notice it so much. And as far as visibility goes, I'll be improving the situation by virtue of changing out the old solid riser blocks with metal risers.

I do like the look of something following the curve, though, no question!

Thanks,

Chris

[Hirilondë]

Can you actually move a traveler to weather hard on the wind with the sail full? Do you actually use the traveler instead of the main sheet to dump the main in a puff? Or do you just set the traveler according to the sheeting angle you want for the conditions and point of sail?

[Bluenose]

Can you actually move a traveler to weather hard on the wind with the sail full? Do you actually use the traveler instead of the main sheet to dump the main in a puff? Or do you just set the traveler according to the sheeting angle you want for the conditions and point of sail?

Obviously Chris will have to come up with own answers but I find that having a well working traveler is a great tool when the wind picks up. Both my traveler and mainsheet are 4 to 1 systems and it is much easier for me to drop the traveler to leeward and bring it back up than releasing and retriming the main. The traveler is one of the components of my half reefs (including the backstay, outhaul, cunningham and halyard tension).

My last boat didn't have a workable traveler so all I had was releasing the main in the puffs. I didn't care for this method much at all. The main would get fuller as I eased the mainsheet trim and the boat heeled more. In order to really get some relief I would have to let the main out until it started flogging a bit. With the new boat and new traveler when I drop the main down with the traveler the main stay flat and tight and all I get is a small bubble in the leading edge of the main, and no flogging. Weather helm is greatly reduced and, most importantly, I maintain my boat speed and control.

I will admit that I don't use it very frequently in light air to bring the main windward but I use it frequently in the puffs.

Bill

[Chris Campbell]

I guess it depends on whether there is another boat around that I want to be inching past instead of being inched past by. I've certainly been known to slip into racing mode in the past...

[LazyGuy]

Personally, I like the look of the curved traveler but that is where it ends. I also dump wind by dumping traveler in a puff (I think we are all racers as heart). To me the whole idea of the traveler is to maintain sail shape going up wind by using the traveler and the reverse curve with a very tight mainsheet might get in the way of dumping wind. I would stick with the ugly flat traveler.

[Oscar]

Food for thought....

If you are ever planning to put a dodger in, a nice glassed "sill" would be helpful. So, you can build those on both sides of the hatch, and then use them as pillars for a straight track across. Get a curved look, a straight (and thus cheaper) traveller, and be ready to anchor the front of the dodger.

[Tim]

More food: if you do decide to consider a sill, or coaming, that incorporates the traveler and might act as a base for the curved forward edge of a dodger dodger, consider involving your canvas person now, so that they might have input as to how to design the coaming to best attach the dodger. This can give you a better end result. The canvas guys are always complaining that they get involved too late and end up being forced to design their product around something that, with some earlier input on their part, could have been designed or constructed slightly differently, which would make the dodger better in the long run.

Just another thought to add to the complication...

[Quetzalsailor]

Certainly, curved travelers are common, however the example you pictured was curved too much (visually). The curve should fit the boat. Quetzal's is curved but not extemely; it follows the camber of the afterdeck.

You can move a traveler under load; Harken will cheerfully sell you the track and linear ball bearing car. They'll bend the track to your spec.; there must be limits to how much curvature a particular car will accommodate. Quetzal's car is hopelessly bad for moving and the movable stops are worn to non-functionality.

Boys who've raced hot small stuff insist on the same functionality in their big stuff; it's only money.

Endgame for me on Quetzal would be a harken track and car, with adequate car control, a two-speed mainsheet, and - what think ye - raising the boom a foot (perhaps just the aft end of the boom). I am truly unhappy with the way Q's boom ends at my forehead, the non-functional traveler, the heap of mainsheet resulting from the end-of-boom-mounted sheet.

[Ceasar Choppy]

Don't be afraid to ask Garhauer how much they would charge to put a curve in your track... I bet you'd be surprised that it doesn't cost much more, if at all. I've heard Harken will put a bend in theirs too if you ask them. My own experience is that with the new Harken low profile track, the track will bend just fine on its own as you bolt it down-- if the bend is not severe (i.e. more than 15deg?).

[Chris Campbell]

I've ordered a flat track and risers, and will put up with the aesthetic. I think it'll be fine, and I'll certainly enjoy having a good traveler. Sailing on my Dad's Ericson 27 a week ago I found myself tweaking the traveler regularly - pull in the jib until it touches the spreaders, then adjust the traveler to windward accordingly. Worked like a charm. I think I'll be happy.

As to the thought of building in something to attach a dodger to - hmm. So far in my boat owning career I've only had one dodger, and that one was attached to a flat cabin top and seemed fine to me. I guess I can see how a ridge on the cabin top would provide more of a wave break, but is it worth it? One thing I really do like is the Hallberg-Rassy windshield with a soft dodger on top (not unlike the dodgers that Gemini makes, that Dennis introduced us to) - but I'm not sure that the Yankee could pull that off without looking pretty silly, and I'm even less certain that I could pull of making one without it looking really amateurish. I guess the best thing to do is what Tim suggests - get the dodger guy/gal involved now. I actually was hoping to postpone that expense, but perhaps it's possible to get the design started while maintaining an understanding that it'll be another year or two before I implement. We'll see.

Thanks, of course, for all the advice and thoughts. This forum really does concentrate a lot of boat knowledge, doesn't it!

Cheers,

Chris

[Tim]

Depending on your canvas person, you probably aren't looking at much of an (or any) expense at this early stage. Rather, this is more of an initial consultation so you can get their ideas as to what you can do during reconstruction to make the dodger better, and their job more effective. The local (to me) people who I am thinking of would be happy to have the chance to have a say in certain aspects of the boat's construction that relate to their eventual canvas work, and they'd be happy to come visit early without requiring a commitment to the dodger job.

If the canvas person doesn't care to do this, then that's fine, but the best of them would agree that they'd prefer to have input at an early stage; they might be shocked to be actually asked, though. It doesn't hurt to ask, in any case; then, during dodger construction, they will have either had their say in advance, or will otherwise have lost their "right" to complain if things aren't ideal from their perspective.

[sscoll]

Tim,
I was looking at photos you posted that include the traveler you put on your Triton. Is that a stock item or did you fabricate it from parts? I've been thinking pretty much along the same line for my boat but haven't gotten to the point of actually acquiring the bits.
Thanks.

Steve

[Tim]

I was given the traveler by another Triton owner way back when; it was a custom-made item (though not by me), and the track was pre-bent to fit the camber. When I received it, it was already 10 years old, but had never been installed on a boat.