Plastic Classic Forum

I had a few rainy days recently where I couldn’t get the tarp off to work on the cap rails, so I thought I would start the “eyebrow” moldings at the point of maximum difficulty (forward). I have two of the tricky corner pieces, and the first straight section roughed out.








Joe

Wow, that's some pretty impressive fitting with the compound angles. I've always wondered if the eyebrows serves any function or if they were just there to look good. It seems like they could be little rain gutters (and I have seen gutters similar to eyebrows) but with the angled house sides I don't think they would work for that.

With that large profile is there a concern about water collecting on top of the eyebrow?

David

With that large profile is there a concern about water collecting on top of the eyebrow?

David,

Good question. I haven't really considered how these things will affect the drainage of the upper decks. I guess I'll find out.

Joe

Looks nice, Joe. Do you have enough room to install the port rings? It looks really close.

I think there's more than enough slope in either or both directions (across the width or length of the piece) to drain water off the top of those eyebrows; I doubt that will be an issue.

WHOA!!!!

Joe you wiley bugger you've been holding out on us!

That looks so sweet. You have renewed my own conviction to do eyebrows. Heck, now I think I want them more than the toerails.

Joe,

Sweet. I am looking forward to see how you are going to handle the step in the coach roof.

I think that in ye olde days, they were used to (functionally) cover the joint where the edge of the canvas that covered the coach roof ended just after it made the turn to the cabin-sides.

It's a great look.

Rachel

Thanks everyone for the words of encouragement!

Looks nice, Joe. Do you have enough room to install the port rings? It looks really close.

The portlights will not yet fit under the sections. They will need a slight recess cut from the underside of molding above the portlight positions. After the same section is fit to the starboard side, I’ll lay a portlight against each of them, scribe the underside of the molding, remove, and cut them out.

The position of the lower sections is, at best, a compromise. As I moved them higher, they just didn’t seem to look right to me, specifically how they harmonize best with the planned location of those on the upper doghouse. Also, the higher they go, the more complex these corner pieces get due to the increasing compound curve of the doghouse there. They are not that easy to construct as it is, in my opinion. So, a recess at the portlights, I guess, it will be.

Joe

Here are a few more photos of the progress today on this project:







Please excuse the absolute messy state of the boat yard.

Joe

Rachel wrote:I think that in ye olde days, they were used to (functionally) cover the joint where the edge of the canvas that covered the coach roof ended just after it made the turn to the cabin-sides.

It's a great look.

Wow, Rachel, that's neat, thanks.

Those look really great. I want some.

The pieces and the fit look great. You've obviously been having fun scribing patterns and hand fitting the pieces. It requires a ton of patience, but is also very satisfying.

How are your cap rail and eyebrow fastened?

Are they removable for painting the hull, deck and cabin?

When I did my exterior trim, all pieces were made, fit etc., then removed. The hull was then painted and the pieces pre-varnished (backs as well). This way varnished wood is bedded to painted fiberglass and there is no mechanical seam where paint meets wood. It assures bedded surfaces are protected for the inevitable seeping at some later time as well. Then the final installation, screws and bungs, and final coats of varnish.

Dave,


I’ve probably taken nearly as much time to do the port side eyebrow moldings than I have to cut the same side cap rails. Attempts to bend the forward eyebrow section to match the curvature of the deck proved futile, so that section is sawn to the curve of the deck and “kerfed” from behind with a fine backsaw, (as one does with curved architectural moldings), to take the fore and aft curvature. The corners, while not essential, did take time, refining the inside curve first, and then the carving the outside profile. Fitting the butt joints between sections also requires much patience. Still, I’m delighted to finally be working wood this winter rather than fiberglass. These have been very gratifying projects, indeed.

Are they removable for painting the hull, deck and cabin?

All the components so far are installed temporarily, with the final placement coming after deck paint (and maybe topside paint). I’m considering leaving 4 of the scarf joints unglued (joined with screws only) so that the rail can be removed in 5 manageable sections for repair or replacement, if necessary.

How are your cap rail and eyebrow fastened?

The lack of liner in the early Triton enables the eyebrow moldings to be fastened from inside. I am using #8 5/8” screws for most of the sections. I am not sure of the type, size, and spacing for fasteners on the cap rails yet. I’ve only drilled for screws that adjoin the scarf joints. Any suggestions are appreciated.

Joe

jhenson wrote:I’ve probably taken nearly as much time to do the port side eyebrow moldings than I have to cut the same side cap rails.

This doesn't surprise me at all. The amount of time it takes to fit custom made pieces to compound curves is phenomenal. Of all the details I have to explain to customers, this type is one of the hardest to quantify.

jhenson wrote:I’m considering leaving 4 of the scarf joints unglued (joined with screws only) so that the rail can be removed in 5 manageable sections for repair or replacement, if necessary.

I am a huge fan of designing components of a boat to come apart. But I don't think I would do this. It is very likely that the seems will open and crack the varnish. Then water will seep in and discolor the wood at the joints and likely start to blow off the varnish. As tedious as it may be, I would likely glue these last several joints simultaneously to the final installation. Or maybe glue these joints in place just before final installation, then lift the entire cap rail in place, apply the bedding, and drop it down and fasten.Any damage in the future to your cap rail will mean cutting out sections anyway, and that is one place the Fein Multimaster shines.

jhenson wrote:The lack of liner in the early Triton enables the eyebrow moldings to be fastened from inside. I am using #8 5/8” screws for most of the sections.

This will look great.

jhenson wrote:I am not sure of the type, size, and spacing for fasteners on the cap rails yet. I’ve only drilled for screws that adjoin the scarf joints. Any suggestions are appreciated.

I don't think it is all that critical. #8s or #10s are fine. The #8 uses a 3/8" countersink and bung, the #10 uses 1/2". Either will seem proportional. I use 6" spacing for the most part for toe rails, but these are sprung. If you use a somewhat adhesive bedding like Sikaflex 291, (I'll spare everyone reading this my solicitations for the product) 8" spacing should be adequate.

Its a long road you travel on your project, but when you make the final installation of your meticulously crafted trim on you shiny freshly painted boat, there will be no words in any language to sum it all up. So just post pictures :)

Hirilondë wrote:Its a long road you travel on your project, but when you make the final installation of your meticulously crafted trim on you shiny freshly painted boat, there will be no words in any language to sum it all up. So just post pictures :)

Well said, and "AMEN!". Nice work Joe!

Dave,

Thanks for your insights! I was tentatively planning on using #10 screws on 6” centers, but since the caps would also act as “rub rails” I considered using bolts every 18” or so. It doesn’t sound like I need to do so.

Mike,

I need to start another thread, I guess, but can you comment on the alterations made on your sliding hatch with what I presume are teak strips glued to the top of the existing surface? Did you do this, or was it done by some previous owner. I’ve enjoyed the pictures on your website. You have a beautiful boat and a fine crew to sail her.

Joe

I think these moldings highlight what may be a slightly negative “visual effect” on the Triton. The deadlights seem, to me, to be out of alignment with the design of this boat. While I’m not at all familiar with the science and art of naval architecture, the placement of these deadlights might be better aligned in perspective.

If you look at the pictures of new eyebrow sections, you’ll notice that an imaginary line drawn over the top of the deadlights appears to be parallel to the deck or shear line of the boat. There is a slight but noticeable angular difference between the top of the deadlights and the upper eyebrow sections.





It seems to me that the deadlights should be parallel with neither of these lines. One would normally expect a design like a boat to have divergent non-parallel lines meet at some imaginary point well forward of the object. Indeed, it looks like the original Alberg drawings have them aligned in perspective.



I like the original deadlights very much, and consider them a prominent feature on the Triton. However, their placement might tend to exaggerate the tendency of these boats to “squat” as Tim has pointed out several times.

I’ve already had to move the location of one these, I certainly wouldn’t move all four for something as trivial.

Just an observation, (and definitely an insignificant one, at that).

Putting it mildly, the rough openings for all the ports on these Tritons were haphazardly-placed at best, and their actual placement may bear little resemblance to what's shown on the drawings, or to what was necessarily intended. There are variations from boat to boat, both in overall positioning and spacing. Some are crooked, though it's not always noticeable.

And don't rely too much on the openings themselves. The way the frames fit in might be a little different, and will change the look somewhat. So whether the alignment lines are off or not, be sure to use the frames as your guide rather than the openings.

I can see what you're talking about (now that you've helpfully pointed out the flaw...), but I doubt it'll truly have a negative effect on the overall appearance when all is said and done. While right now they seem to obviously draw your eye the way you describe, by the time you get frames in, coamings on, rigging up, paint, and so forth, it'll never be noticeable. It's such a small thing.

Strike an appropriate boot top and there'll be no sign of any sag. The "sag" is a direct result of the fact that the boats just don't float to their DWL in the stern. I've yet to see one that does.

In the end, I don't think it's probably worth trying to "fix" something like this. The overall visual effect is so minimal, and the other details of your boat are going to be what's noticed.

jhenson wrote:Mike,I need to start another thread, I guess, but can you comment on the alterations made on your sliding hatch with what I presume are teak strips glued to the top of the existing surface? Joe

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